Introduction [00:00:02] Welcome to the All About Digital Marketing podcast. The show all about digital marketing, digital marketing, digital marketing, digital marketing brought to you by Social INK, the digital marketing agency specialising in social media and content marketing for brave brands and forward-thinking SMEs. I’m your host, Chris Bruno, and as always, we’re here to bring you the most actionable tips, tricks, tools and insights to help you achieve more when it comes to your digital marketing. Subscribe to the show and be sure to share with a friend if you found something useful or interesting. You can find all the show notes and more information on www.AllAboutDigitalMarketing.co.uk.
Chris Bruno [00:00:54] Maggie, thank you very much for joining us today.
Maggie Bruk [00:00:56] Thanks for having me.
Chris Bruno [00:00:58] So, Maggie, you’re the Marketing Manager at Shocklogic. For anybody who doesn’t know about Shocklogic and who doesn’t know about Maggie. Can you tell us a little bit about yourself and the company?
Maggie Bruk [00:01:09] Yes, so. I am originally from Perth in Western Australia. And now based in London. And I have quite a background in film. So before I came to London, I was working as a video editor at the Australian Broadcasting Corporation.
Maggie Bruk [00:01:25] And then in 2011, I decided to make the big move to London. And I spent a few years freelancing as a video editor over here. And then I was asked to work on some videos for Shocklogic. And close to seven years later, I’m still with Shock Logic and I’m managing marketing and design. So a little bit about Shocklogic. So we are a supplier to the events industry and we provide different technology solutions for event organisers and associations. So basically to help them take some of the pressure off when they’re organising events so they can focus on their attendees instead of all the management and organising stuff. So some of the stuff that we do is registration and ticketing for events. We do access control of various exhibitions, software, mobile apps. And now because of my background, we are providing digital marketing to some of our clients. So in the form of video, for example, and this industry is really cool because we have such a wide range of events that we work with. So one day it could be a medical conference, another day it could be an electronic music festival. So, yeah, it’s really interesting to market to these different people.
Chris Bruno [00:02:57] That sounds pretty cool.
Maggie Bruk [00:02:58] Yeah.
Chris Bruno [00:02:59] Niching down without niching down.
Maggie Bruk [00:03:01] Yes.
Chris Bruno [00:03:02] OK. Well, let me take you back a little bit there, because you were talking about the background in film and obviously for all us marketers everywhere and for all those people who are starting a business or currently, you know, the small team or start up. Storytelling is such a vital part of everything we do. And I’m guessing with the background of video, it’s going to have been a massive part of everything that you’ve done as well. Can you talk us through your thoughts on storytelling for business?
Maggie Bruk [00:03:29] Yes, absolutely. So I feel like our story for our company is what helps us to stand out.
Maggie Bruk [00:03:37] So we are a family run business. We have a father and son and a lot of people related. So it’s it’s that’s definitely a big selling point that we’re talking to real people. Definitely. It sets us apart from our competitors. If you check our like social media, you will see real photos of the real team out and about and supporting all the events. We also make sure that we don’t just take a sales pitch on our social media platforms.
Maggie Bruk [00:04:13] So we like to share industry knowledge. We are also focussing on topics for 2020 that are not necessarily for our industry. So we can branch out into different fields. For example, our CEO is really into wellbeing and mindfulness and meditations. So he actually spoke about that at some events.
Maggie Bruk [00:04:38] So I’m finding that’s a really good angle for us because we’ve made, reaching more people that we don’t necessarily reach.
Chris Bruno [00:04:48] That’s awesome. And in terms of sort of your history and what you’ve done in the past, how important would you say it is for companies or for anyone out there listening to start incorporating that storytelling? Because what you’ve talked about there, I think is hugely important. The people behind the business. It doesn’t matter if you’re a B2B organization or B2C. It’s all about people and it’s all about people buying into other people. So how important would you say that is for? For small businesses and start-ups today to actually embrace who they are, to showcase who they are, and to really give that real image of who they are online when it comes to their marketing?
Maggie Bruk [00:05:25] Absolutely. I think it’s really important. People like to work with people and build relationships and if they know who they’re talking to, I think, it’s a nice team member. And people say, oh, yeah, “the Shocklogic team are really nice. And we see what they’re up to.” We see it. We go out and people say to us, oh, I saw, you know, John was here or there and travelling around. It’s real. I think it gives us that personal edge over some of our competitors who are huge and they might use know stock photos, just, you know, the boardroom or something that’s not very relatable. So I think, yeah, the story of people that want to work with people and build relationships.
Chris Bruno [00:06:13] I couldn’t agree more. People like people who are like people. I can’t remember the exact phrase. Something along those lines. Okay, cool. So when it comes to your social media, what for you is the most important aspect of what you’re currently doing to showcase the company, to really kind of give people the right impression?
Maggie Bruk [00:06:35] So we are focussing on lots of our own team videos. So we recently did a little campaign about well-being in our industry, and we spoke to different team members and they kind of did their own video and spoke about things that they do to relieve some of the stress that they might feel in this industry.
Maggie Bruk [00:07:01] And we. So then people see who are real, you know, what we’re really facing, what we’re doing. Get to know our team. And then through these videos, we then wrote a blog and just created a lot more content.
Maggie Bruk [00:07:16] Just off the back of those videos had some good engagement as well. So that’s I think the video strategy is definitely what we’re focussing on in our social media at the moment.
Chris Bruno [00:07:26] So I want to pick up on one thing that you mentioned there. This is something that we tell all our clients and we try and hopefully get this message across and a lot of our guests have as well.
Chris Bruno [00:07:35] One video actually can create a load of content for you. And I think this is something that’s really important to reiterate. This idea of repurposing content from, for example, having a longer format interview to then having shorter clips of that interview, whether that then gets rewritten up into a blog, whether that’s transcribed. This is huge. I mean, creating that initial pillar content, as it were, and then creating all the variations of that. I’m guessing that plays a big part in your day today as well for the marketing and especially for the video strategy?
Maggie Bruk [00:08:10] Absolutely. Yes. So this one video can, as you said, create a lot more content. But for us with the video strategy, we never go in without lots of planning. So we’ll always, even if by talking to a team member, will already have in our heads kind of what we want from them and write scripts. So I think for us, that really helps us to make sure we focus on the content that we want to be putting out there. So I would say, yeah, all that preparation beforehand, which from my background is what I learned and what I’m teaching to my team, how to write a script and a storyboard, for example. So I think they’re really good tools.
Chris Bruno [00:08:50] So the old expression fail to prepare and you prepare to fail. Couldn’t be truer.
Maggie Bruk [00:08:56] Exactly. Or I like, overprepare and go with the flow.
Chris Bruno [00:09:02] I think it’s completely right. And actually, there’s a lot of people as well that try and wing certain things when it comes to videos. And they’re not necessarily ready for it or they’re not necessarily sure on what they’re trying to say. And it can be very difficult. But actually, that brings me on to a nice sort of pivot there.
Chris Bruno [00:09:20] But do you guys ever find yourselves doing live videos, using the power of social media, things like Facebook or Insta or anything else to go live and to showcase where you’re at and the events of what you’re doing or what the team is up to?
Maggie Bruk [00:09:32] A little bit. But we do tend to do more photos live. A lot of posting with photos, some videos, maybe little clips. Yes. But we do like to then, as coming from an editing background. I love to be able to edit things. So we do often come back and work on those videos.
Maggie Bruk [00:09:55] But yeah if we’re at an event we would we would stream, for example. We do educational sessions where some of our team members speak. So if that was on, we would definitely do like a live stream. Makes people feel like they’re part of the action for sure.
Chris Bruno [00:10:12] That’s interesting. And in terms of so getting all this video content out and stuff, from your point of view, what sort of social media channels are the ones that are really working to help you guys drive engagement and also leads, obviously?
Maggie Bruk [00:10:27] Yes. We use Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn for videos, and it seems to do well across all of these platforms.
Maggie Bruk [00:10:37] Lots of views, lots of engagements. Yeah, especially when we tag certain people on Facebook that are in the videos, that gives a lot more engagement. But yeah, I would say all platforms for me. Video is probably the best engagement. Yeah.
Chris Bruno [00:10:56] Okay. That’s interesting. So what if you had to choose a favourite personal for personal reasons a favourite social media network? Which one would it be?
Maggie Bruk [00:11:07] For me personally? Instagram is for me. Definitely. I’m definitely a visual person. Instagram Stories, photos. But as a company we are B2B so we are not focussing on Instagram so much, but it could be something that we are going to start using as well. Something to think about.
Chris Bruno [00:11:31] Okay. That’s interesting. So we had recently I interviewed, had a great conversation with Xenia, the CEO of Planable, and funnily enough her personal selection was exactly the same as yours and for pretty much the same reasons. So it’s quite interesting to hear that in terms of the visual side of things, liking to see the striking image et cetera. So it’s good to see that we’re not alone in these things that we all like. They are the same sort of platforms for the same sort of reason. So for B2B businesses out there, then how would you recommend that they approach it when it comes to. Again, we’re talking about B2B, but we have mentioned that. We’re talking about, you know, it’s people that buy people. So how would you recommend for small business or a start-up for them to really start engaging with other human beings, other people out there, even though they are focussed on B2B?
Maggie Bruk [00:12:25] Yes. So I would recommend identifying perhaps some topics that you are experts in or some knowledge that you’d like to share and focus on. We tend to kind of choose a couple per year, so it could be an industry trend that’s quite big that year and decide, okay, we’re going to have some discussions about this or we’re going to create content about this.
Maggie Bruk [00:12:55] So if, for example, last year with the big GDPR, the regulation that came in. We actually created our own story about GDPR. And we created characters and we did this all within my team as a really cute little book to make GDPR less scary and less boring. We kind of had a story about people facing GDPR in their company. And then we use this as a digital thing. We made video out of it.
Maggie Bruk [00:13:30] So yeah, we just identified. Okay. This year everyone’s going to be talking about GDPR. Let’s jump on this. So it wasn’t necessarily something we were an expert in before we started, but we chose that as our top pick for the year or for six months and researched and created this bit of content. So yeah, I think that would be something that I think everyone can do.
Chris Bruno [00:13:55] Okay, that’s interesting, actually. So if would you say sort of you’re getting involved in the conversation so you know that this is going to be a big conversation. You know, it’s going to be everywhere. You know, everyone’s gonna be talking about it. So getting involved into that conversation gives you that additional exposure and a point of difference in a way to stand out. But also just to basically help showcase who you because I mean, I’m guessing it directly. Sorry, it indirectly impacts a lot of what you guys do in terms of the technology behind everything, you know? Mail lists from guests and attendees. Where did they sign up? How did they sign up? Did they opt-in? Did they give you express permission to email them afterwards, etc. And better sense of, you know, you’re not selling any service that’s directly relating to GDPR or any kind of thing like that. So what’s the premise behind it in terms of jumping in and getting involved in these conversations?
Maggie Bruk [00:14:48] Yes. So firstly, we look like a trusted company because we know what we’re talking about in these subjects.
Maggie Bruk [00:14:56] It gives us, I think, a lot more dimensions as a company than just talking about event technology. What we go to a lot of events and there’s educational programs. There’s always the standard, “what’s coming up in event technology” kind of sessions and it gets a bit boring, so. Well. Okay. Let’s talk about something a bit different. But then, as you said, we can relate it back, so we’ll be maybe about digital marketing or how to run a small business and inspire your team. So it’s, they’re top picks that we can relate back to our company, building trust. Again, getting to know our people.
Chris Bruno [00:15:41] That’s interesting because it’s not focussing at all on the sales pitch, which exactly is probably remarkably nice and refreshing for so many people. Yes, exactly. Because they’re not just getting pitched at. They’re not just getting that kind of usual. We do this. We do that. This is why you should use us here.
Maggie Bruk [00:15:58] Yeah, exactly. That’s definitely how we try to stand out.
Chris Bruno [00:16:03] Okay. That’s awesome. I like that. Okay. So in terms of for an events company, so let’s say that we’re, we have a small events company that’s trying to start up or that they have just recently started out, they’ve started doing these little events. What are the key things for them that you think really helps those companies to actually build and to be able to scale the business and what they’re trying to do?
Maggie Bruk [00:16:26] Yeah, I guess going to the right events, definitely networking, doing your research.
Maggie Bruk [00:16:34] For example, we’ve, we identify who the influencers are on our, in our social media. We have a hashtag called #eventprofs. So it would be very important to follow that and to see what’s going on. So, yeah, I think that’s definitely a big tip. Identifying the hashtag for your industry. Watch that. See what’s going on. Join the conversation as you said, and start putting your name out there in that way.
Chris Bruno [00:17:03] I’m glad to say that not just watch it, but actually join the conversation.
Maggie Bruk [00:17:07] Yes, definitely.
Chris Bruno [00:17:09] This is something I think a lot of people fall down, unfortunately, on this side of things where they watch and watch and watch and are hoping for miracles to happen on their own content. But they don’t actually take steps to necessarily become part of a bigger conversation or somebody else’s conversation. There was a really good example that came up on a previous episode where we were talking about Kentucky Fried Chicken. Now KFC sell chicken, nothing while, but they have an absolutely phenomenal team working behind their UK Twitter channel and they actually called out all their competitors in a tweet, tagging them all in it properly and to the point where I think they had left out Domino’s. So they had covered Mickey D and Burger King and a few others, Pizza Hut or something like that. And Domino’s team actually replied to that post by saying, I think you forgot about us. To try and get back into the conversation. But again, it’s this idea that there is enough. There’s nothing to be scared about getting involved. And it’s not because it’s a competitor who’s having that conversation or another company or whatever it is. It’s an industry-wide conversation. It’s a conversation where if you can add value to it, you’re adding value to an audience. And those obviously the audience is potential clients. Would you agree with that?
Maggie Bruk [00:18:25] Yes, absolutely. And if you have people in your company, does it have to be a sales team or your marketing team? You want to be out there and speaking? Great. So that’s where we’ve now we’ve actually got too many people now that, oh, I want to be out there speaking, which I think is a great position to be in, because often when we get the camera out in the office, it gets avoided. So it’s just identifying who are these team members that want to be the voice of the company and are happy to be in front of the camera.
Chris Bruno [00:19:04] So I think that’s quite interesting how that changes over time, how that changes from, “No I don’t really want to do that. I’m not sure about that.” And then suddenly, once you’ve done it once, twice, three times, and then you’re like that, this is awesome. I like this. I enjoy this.
Maggie Bruk [00:19:19] Yes, exactly. Sometimes a little push.
Chris Bruno [00:19:25] Okay, that’s cool.
Chris Bruno [00:19:26] So if we talked about in general terms, we’re there for us on this show, what we want to try and do is give as much insight and as much advice as possible to anyone out there that starting no matter what sort of stage they’re in. What would you say are the key digital marketing, either channels or techniques, for lack of a better word that you would say are really, really important to focus on right now? So, for example, it could be, you know, building your mail list, creating funnels, creating video content, social media, how you distribute, whatever it might be. But from your point of view, what do you think is the most important thing or something that people should really be concentrating on today?
Maggie Bruk [00:20:06] Yes. So in terms of social media, I would say if you’re a small company, don’t try and put something out on every channel.
Maggie Bruk [00:20:16] Pick a couple of channels that you know you can do well and focus on producing great content for those channels. If you don’t have the resources, don’t try and put out Instagram, LinkedIn, Facebook, Snapchat posts all at once because you will – the quality will not be as good because you will be trying to put out too much content. So I think definitely pick a couple of channels that work for you personally. I don’t want to say you must use this channel. Having said that, though, we are using LinkedIn a lot as a sales and marketing tool. Just the engagement is incredible. We get the most likes and shares via LinkedIn accounts compared to any other platform. So I think working on your LinkedIn posts for sure. I think people don’t do this enough as a company.
Chris Bruno [00:21:17] That’s interesting, actually. The LinkedIn angle, because you’re right, a lot of people get distracted by the shiny new thing or they heard Gary V on a video talking about TikTok. So they’ve now signed up TikTok. And they’re trying to create new content. And like you mentioned, it’s not that one is right for everybody or that that’s wrong or anything else. But it is definitely about having that balance of you’re better off creating amazing content for a tiny audience on one platform. But that audience is really engaged, believes in who you are. What you do is sharing, engaging, getting involved in that conversation. Than basically, you know, a scattergun approach of throwing anything and everything up anywhere and then just hoping that something sticks somewhere along the line.
Maggie Bruk [00:22:03] Exactly. And that’s the same goes for people who think, oh, I need to, you know, increase my followers, I’m going to purchase followers. It’s just pointless. It’s much better to have a small audience. Who, as you said, are really engaged, part of the conversation. Quality over quantity. For sure.
Chris Bruno [00:22:23] Absolutely. It’s actually it’s, I think it was Seth Godin that talks about it in one of his latest books. But it’s all about the minimum viable audience. So in the same ways we look at product. And we say, let’s get out the MVP, let’s get out the minimum viable product so that we can get it to market and get some feedback. But the exact same is true for your audience. You know, having a hundred people that really believe in what you do and share that and talk to other people about it in a really emphatic and enthusiastic way is worth having a million fake followers, which eventually ends up equating to zero leads to zero sales, zero revenue, and ultimately, unfortunately no money in the bank, which usually is a bad thing at the end of the month.
Maggie Bruk [00:23:02] Yes, exactly.
Chris Bruno [00:23:05] Okay. So we’ve looked at this and we talked about the minimum viable audience. We’ve talked about obviously, you know, keeping it in line with who you are, what you do, limiting what you’re going to do to make sure that you can keep creating quality. Would you say that, obviously, from your background, I’m guessing you’re a little bit biased towards video potentially. But in terms of that, are you guys using, you know, the standard kind of funnel systems to get people through? Are you building this business in the same sort of traditional methods or are you guys doing things slightly different, trying to have more conversations one to one or at events or things like that? Just to give people an idea of what sort of what sort of techniques they can use and how they can kind of get themselves out there.
Maggie Bruk [00:23:48] Yeah. So a big focus for us is definitely trade shows where we’ll have our stand and our marketing and sales team on. We definitely we’ve got one coming up in a couple of weeks. We do a lot of research beforehand and we do email campaigns, targeted ones to specific types of clients. And when we are at these events, we will then have in-depth conversations with these people to really get to know them and understand them and make sure we if we add them to a mailing list, we will put them, we do put filters on people. So when we do send out communications, we know, okay, this person is based in the UK, so I will send them info about something in the UK or they’re this type of company, we won’t sell to them about something that’s not relevant. So I think yeah, these trade shows, really getting to know what people want and need. That’s been a really good source for us getting new leads in.
Chris Bruno [00:24:53] Interesting. I like that. And obviously especially within the events industry itself, whereby they know the events itself is kind of the big thing, the big part of.
Maggie Bruk [00:25:02] Exactly.
Chris Bruno [00:25:03] I think that’s really interesting. Do you see that being the same in lots of industry still today, or do you think that there’s certain industries that have kind of outgrown the event or the trade show kind of style?
Maggie Bruk [00:25:16] Yeah, I mean. I don’t think we’re outgrowing events and trade shows, because going back to people like people. People are still attending events.
Maggie Bruk [00:25:27] People are still you know, people still go to the cinema. People still go to concerts, even though we can watch everything at home. So I don’t think. Yeah. I don’t think that’s changing. I think we still want the human contact for sure.
Chris Bruno [00:25:42] Okay. No, I like that. To be honest with you, I haven’t been to as many trade shows that I’ve seen sort of changes to certain, to certain events and especially around tech.
Maggie Bruk [00:25:53] Yes.
Maggie Bruk [00:25:53] Where the space I think moved so quickly and things are changing and developing so quickly. But I feel like there’s been more of a shift towards smaller events that are a bit more niche within even even already niched down, but niches within niches, as it were, rather than the big, big events that you used to have where, you know, you’d end up with five thousand people walking around for three days desperately trying not to get lost and to try and find a coffee.
Maggie Bruk [00:26:20] Yes.
Chris Bruno [00:26:21] And I’ve seen that kind of shift happen. But are you guys seeing something similar as well in across different industries?
Maggie Bruk [00:26:28] Yeah. So we actually put on our an event a couple of weeks ago where we just had 20 clients. So it was a very small event in a small room. And we spoke about technology and we’ve got these clients to submit maybe some challenges that they were having. Doesn’t have to be about Shock Logic could be anything in the industry to do with marketing and tech. And it was really valuable. Really good conversations tailored to exactly what, as you said, quite a niche thing, completely tailored to what they were after. So, yeah, you’re right. There is definitely, there’s more focussed smaller events as well. So, yeah, and there’s a lot of hybrid events as well. We’re seeing so a lot of events might have a big trade show, but then there’ll be quite a big online presence as well. So people who are joining remotely. So I see that as well happening.
Chris Bruno [00:27:28] You pick I’m going to pick up on something you just said there that I find really, really interesting and fascinating. And I think, again, massive thing that people miss. And it’s such a big opportunity. But you’ve just mentioned there, you know, having a small, almost round table type event where you’ve preselected certain clients to come along. And you’ve asked them in advance to give you some insight into what the things are that they’re struggling with, which is enormous, because, one, it’s the best possible insight for you as a business or for us when we ask our clients, you know, what are you struggling with or even our audience online? What are you struggling with? We get to understand what the masses or the consensus is. You know, if multiple people say they’re struggling with X, then the chances are there’s a there’s actually a niche there. There’s a certain requirement, there’s a problem that needs solving. And I think this is something that we find a lot, especially with start-ups and especially with tech start-ups in the early stages where a founder or multiple founders have had the idea in their head for so long of what they wanted to build that they sometimes forget that actually the only people that really matter in general terms is actually the clients who are going to use it at the end of the day. So what an amazing way to actually do that, bringing 20 people together in one room, asking them in advance what they want then and then actually being able to go through that with them and get that immediate feedback loop even for yourselves as you start to sort of understand better or understand in more detail what it is that they’re actually struggling with.
Maggie Bruk [00:28:58] Yeah, absolutely. So definitely a new one for us, but it worked really well. So we’ll be doing something like that again soon.
Chris Bruno [00:29:06] Yeah. Sounds awesome. I like the sound of that. Okay. So penultimate question for you then, Maggie. What’s the biggest single piece of advice you’d give to anyone out there who’s either struggling with their digital marketing, just starting out with their digital marketing? What’s the biggest piece of advice you can give them?
Maggie Bruk [00:29:25] One piece.
Chris Bruno [00:29:26] I put you on the spot.
Maggie Bruk [00:29:27] Yeah, I would say as I mentioned before, identify, for example, what the social media is going to focus on. And if you’re going to get into video, by a lapel mic, this is going to be my one big piece of advice. So audio needs to be good on your videos.
Chris Bruno [00:29:49] So I was about to ask, is that is that just a piece of advice or is that a little bit of a pet hate the way that came about.
Maggie Bruk [00:29:57] I mean, it’s very simple. It said it’s. Yeah. So I know we do subtitles now on lots of videos, but if you’re going to record a video, you need to think about the sound that’s coming out as well, not just what you’re seeing. So you can get it cheap mic and plug that straight into your iPhone and it will improve your video quality by a lot.
Chris Bruno [00:30:24] I couldn’t agree more. And what I’m talking to you, I have a pair of just normal JBL headphones in to do this conversation with you and we’re recording two streams separately for the podcast and at the same time I have my Shure lapel mic plugged into my iPhone separately recording everything that I’m saying from my end to make sure that we get a half decent version of what I’m saying at the same time, so I am 100 percent behind you on that. Yes. It’s actually one of the one things that’s a real shame with iPhones and everything like that, because we can literally record 4K quality imagery with our phones. But yet the sound is absolutely shocking.
Maggie Bruk [00:31:02] Yeah, exactly.
Chris Bruno [00:31:04] And it is a real shame. Maggie. Okay. So where can people find you? Where can people find Shocklogic online if they want to get in touch?
Maggie Bruk [00:31:13] Yes. So you can follow us on Twitter @shocklogic, our website www.shocklogic.com or you can also email us at firstname.lastname@example.org.
Chris Bruno [00:31:25] Fantastic. Well, listen, Maggie, thank you so much for the call and the conversation today. I’ve really enjoyed it. And here’s to a lot more events going on and a lot more technology to help those of.
Maggie Bruk [00:31:36] Yes. Thanks so much for having me.
Chris Bruno [00:31:39] Thank you.
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